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Posted: 4/8/2024 6:51:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: hoody2shoez]
Temp around 65°
Cool air, warm sun. Data was taken with garmin chrono I tried to get groups but strong unpredictable gusts up to 30 mph in varying directions made it too difficult to isolate the ammo for consistent groups Black hills 77 otm's red box. Unknown if this batch used the 77 sierra or the 77 hornady. All shot with suppressor. Data is avg of all strings. (3 strings 25 rounds) High 2690 low 2622 avg 2649 Std dev 21 Ex spread 68 Black hills 69 TMK (only 1 string of 10 rounds) High 2732 low 2683 Avg 2700 Std dev 18 Ex spread 49 Aac 75 gr w/o suppressor (1 string 10 rounds) High 2600 low 2505 Avg 2554 Std dev 29 Ex spread 95 Aac 75 gr w/ suppressor. Avg of all strings (5 strings 50 rounds) High 2647 low 2516 Avg 2557 Std dev 24 Ex spread 131 Now comes the part I was most excited about. I tested the badlands co 75 and 77 gr loaded in the Nas3 casings. These have given some really high velocities and I was hoping I would get similar. I was a bit let down. 75 gr w/ suppressor (4 strings 40 shots) High 2738 low 2619 Avg 2669 Std dev 26 Ex spread 119 The 77's where similarly "slow" for what I had hoped for. (3 strings 30 shots) High 2705 low 2571 Avg 2638 Std dev 28 Ex spread 134 (3 very low velocity shots) If I exclude the low velocity shots I come up with 77's Avg 2651 Std dev 18 Ex spread 84 75's Avg 2675 Std dev 24 Ex spread 99 It should be noted that after taking out the shots that where much slower there were basically 2 velocities for the 75's. Most where within a few fps of 2650 OR 2700 the 77's didn't have the two distinct groups the 75's did. The last test was a poi shift when the suppressor is removed. My aac 75's (what it's zeroed on) shift .75moa left and 0moa vertically *edit* spoke with the dudes at badlands. I called strictly to give data and feedback to which they didn't find the data satisfactory. They agreed the velocities were about 75 fps slower on average then they would have guessed (should have been about 2750) and they Ex spread should have been half. Long story short they will send me some new ammo to test when i get home from this upcoming deployment, none of which I asked for. That was really cool of them. On a side note the Nas3 ammo was felt way less gassy than the aac ammo. |
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Did I miss it?
PS.............. Yes, Yes I did miss it. ;) Sorry. |
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Well somehow I missed NAS3 being a thing.
I read this and thought there was a chrono error or the ammo was about to explode from overpressure getting those velocities from a 12.5" barrel. Then I Googled NAS3... Interesting. That SD is about the same as most good AR15 ammo like Black Hills. You are not shooting a bolt gun. You are not going to find single digit SD loads for an AR15 that are not single loaded / individually weighed charges. Those velocities are about what most 16" 5.56 barrels produce. |
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Originally Posted By DevL: Well somehow I missed NAS3 being a thing. I read this and thought there was a chrono error or the ammo was about to explode from overpressure getting those velocities from a 12.5" barrel. Then I Googled NAS3... Interesting. That SD is about the same as most good AR15 ammo like Black Hills. You are not shooting a bolt gun. You are not going to find single digit SD loads for an AR15 that are not single loaded / individually weighed charges. Those velocities are about what most 16" 5.56 barrels produce. View Quote No chrono error. This is the 4th chrono I've used with black hills and all have been consistent. I used them as a control group at the beginning for this reason The SD is fine. The ES isn't |
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The velocities seem awfully fast for a 12.5 Criterion. I have an 11.5" Criterion and a 16" Criterion, both Hybrid contour, 1:8" twist, .223 Wylde chambers. I'm at 1,000' ASL and over past several months it was 35 - 60 degrees when I shot.
In my 11.5", 75 gr AAC Hornady BTHP chrono close to 2,500 FPS per my LabRadar. AAC 77 SMK chrono around 2,620 - 2,650 FPS in my 16" Criterion. ES and SD wasn't bad, IIRC around 30-40 ES and 15-20 ES. I don't have any other load info handy. |
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Most 12.5's chrono closer to 14.5's than 11.5's
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Thank you for the info.
I have a 12.5" Criterion CORE waiting to be installed. And your speeds are respectable for sure. No pressure indications on the brass ? |
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*Hold on to your AR-15s. Their magic must be very powerful, or they wouldn’t want them.*
JAFOM.... Just another fat old man. ________________________________ TOGC,IADC |
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I have a Criterion 14.5 Core and a 16 Core. The 14.5 core shoots AAC 77 OTM around 2700 fps. Thats right around what my 18 inch WOA barrel shoots them at. The 16 shoots them at around 2650. Not sure what is up with that 14.5, but it is my most accurate barrel and my fastest barrel. The 14.5 is easily a 3/4 minute gun. The 16 is much more in line with normal velocities. I have been tempted to get an 18 inch Core just to see what it does.
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Point shooting will give you monkeypox. - John_Wayne777
The Emu War could have been won if the Australians used red dots on their handguns. |
Originally Posted By DevL:. You are not going to find single digit SD loads for an AR15 that are not single loaded / individually weighed charges. View Quote Originally Posted By hoody2shoez: Most 12.5's chrono closer to 14.5's than 11.5's View Quote Edit: decided to take the Labradar with me today: 81*F 12.5” Hodge/Velos Federal XM855 2819 fps 39 es 13.6 sd 12.5” BCM Kino/TurboK XM855 2825 fps 69 es 20.3 sd 12.5” Criterion Core/.264 MG7k XM855 2824 fps 31 es 9.5 sd 69gr Norma .223 2620 fps 38 es 11.1 sd |
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Originally Posted By hoody2shoez: Temp around 65° Cool air, warm sun. Data was taken with garmin chrono I tried to get groups but strong unpredictable gusts up to 30 mph in varying directions made it too difficult to isolate the ammo for consistent groups Black hills 77 otm's red box. Unknown if this batch used the 77 sierra or the 77 hornady. All shot with suppressor. Data is avg of all strings. (3 strings 25 rounds) High 2690 low 2622 avg 2649 Std dev 21 Ex spread 68 Black hills 69 TMK (only 1 string of 10 rounds) High 2732 low 2683 Avg 2700 Std dev 18 Ex spread 49 Aac 75 gr w/o suppressor (1 string 10 rounds) High 2600 low 2505 Avg 2554 Std dev 29 Ex spread 95 Aac 75 gr w/ suppressor. Avg of all strings (5 strings 50 rounds) High 2647 low 2516 Avg 2557 Std dev 24 Ex spread 131 Now comes the part I was most excited about. I tested the badlands co 75 and 77 gr loaded in the Nas3 casings. These have given some really high velocities and I was hoping I would get similar. I was a bit let down. 75 gr w/ suppressor (4 strings 40 shots) High 2738 low 2619 Avg 2669 Std dev 26 Ex spread 119 The 77's where similarly "slow" for what I had hoped for. (3 strings 30 shots) High 2705 low 2571 Avg 2638 Std dev 28 Ex spread 134 (3 very low velocity shots) If I exclude the low velocity shots I come up with 77's Avg 2651 Std dev 18 Ex spread 84 75's Avg 2675 Std dev 24 Ex spread 99 It should be noted that after taking out the shots that where much slower there were basically 2 velocities for the 75's. Most where within a few fps of 2650 OR 2700 the 77's didn't have the two distinct groups the 75's did. The last test was a poi shift when the suppressor is removed. My aac 75's (what it's zeroed on) shift .75moa left and 0moa vertically *edit* spoke with the dudes at badlands. I called strictly to give data and feedback to which they didn't find the data satisfactory. They agreed the velocities were about 75 fps slower on average then they would have guessed (should have been about 2750) and they Ex spread should have been half. Long story short they will send me some new ammo to test when i get home from this upcoming deployment, none of which I asked for. That was really cool of them. On a side note the Nas3 ammo was felt way less gassy than the aac ammo. View Quote Criterion Cores are all I run now on my 5.56 guns, except that my 12.5 has a hybrid semi heavy profile. I'll be running one in 300 BO when I can find one. The numbers you're getting are in line with what I'm getting. As an estimate, I'm getting ~3000 fps with my 14.5 and 13.9 with M193, and ~2900 fps with M855 and ~2800 fps with 69s. The sames loads out of my 12.5 run ~100 fps slower. I like the 12.5. It's handy and you don't sacrifice much. Criterion barrels are a great bang for the buck. Oddly, I decided to do a 16" build and since I couldn't source a Criterion barrel, I grabbed one from ballistic advantage. I just figured I'd do a build where bdcs would line up and take the velocity perk. It turned out that the BA barrel got the same velocities of my 14.5 Criterion. I tore it apart and threw the barrel in the parts bin. |
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Originally Posted By 1168RGR: I wouldn’t be quick to say never. I load on a automated/motorized progressive, and never individually weigh charges, and I often get SDs in the teens, with low teens being pretty common. The same was true on a XL750. 10 round samples. I sometimes get single digit SDs with 9mm for my PCC like this. I’m not going to say that this will match everyone's experience, just that it is possible. Absolutely. One of the reasons I like my 12.5” barrels so much. Edit: decided to take the Labradar with me today: 81*F 12.5” Hodge/Velos Federal XM855 2819 fps 39 es 13.6 sd 12.5” BCM Kino/TurboK XM855 2825 fps 69 es 20.3 sd 12.5” Criterion Core/.264 MG7k XM855 2824 fps 31 es 9.5 sd 69gr Norma .223 2620 fps 38 es 11.1 sd View Quote Those are some good es and sd |
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Any updates on the newer batch of Badlands NAS loadings?
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