Has anyone seen this?

The 2015 Rules Update is out and it includes new divisions as well as a new pistol caliber carbine division.

http://tarheel3gun.com/t3gn/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/3-Gun-Nation-REGIONAL-SERIES-RULES-2015-FINAL-FORMAT-v2.pdf

Thoughts?

I am the current author/keeper of probably the most prolific set of Outlaw 3-Gun Rules, so what I have to say comes from considerable personal experience.

Firstly, my head hurts reading those rules; the format with no indentation, lots of bold/underline, and incorrect English all makes it hard to grind through. Using unfamiliar division names does not help either.

A lot of the requirements seem to be ill-defined (e.g. "factory configuration") and/or unenforceable (e.g. Factory Shotgun maximum capacity?). I am also not a fan of the current trend of downgrading safety-related penalties from a match DQ to a small time penalty - abandoning an unsafe gun and firing slugs at close-range steel both meaningfully impact safety on the range and should be discouraged by more than a 10-second penalty IMHO. The rules seem to be written with the goal of making things as forgiving as possible for the competitor, at the expense of safety and competitive equity.

I do give 3GN credit for shaking things up with the equipment divisions though. It looks like their heart is in the right place.

Can I still use my 1x4 scope in the new version of the Tac ops division " Practical Division ".

One more reason I'm glad we dumped 3GN a year ago. Politically correct targets. Now politically correct divisions. If it weren't for the televised Pro Series the Club and Regional Series never would have got off the ground with this crap.

I'm confused on the new ditching rule.  Is it basically saying now that if a firearm is ditched with an empty chamber, regardless if it has ammo in the tube or magazine, it is acceptable, regardless of safety position?  Because the rule specifically no longer mentions the safety position.

Here are the two acceptable ditching conditions:

1.5.1.1 Safety Condition One "Loaded with Safety Engaged"
1.5.1.1.1 Pistols with ANY type of manual safety lever must be engaged to satisfy the “loaded on safe” condition
regardless of passive safeties.
1.5.1.1.2 Pistols without a manual safety MUST have passive safeties in OPERATIONAL condition; this will satisfy
the safety engaged requirement. A "Passive Safety" is a safety that engages automatically and disables the firearm from
discharging while the firearm is not being handled. "Safe Action" striker safeties or "Passive Trigger Safeties" fall under
this ruling. "Operational" means: The safety operates correctly as intended. It must not be altered or disabled in a way
that while not being handled, the safety features can no longer prevent the firearm from discharging.
1.5.1.1.3 If the pistol has no manual safety and the only manual lever is a de-cocking mechanism, it must be engaged
and the hammer must be de-cocked to satisfy the safety engaged condition.

And the second safe ditching condition.  Notice it says nothing about the position of the safety.

1.5.1.2 Safety Condition Two "Empty Chamber"
1.5.1.2.1 Empty chamber, with no live rounds in the feed tube or the magazine removed.
1.5.1.2.2 Empty chamber, slide/bolt locked open with loaded feed tube or loaded magazine inserted.
1.5.1.2.3 Empty chamber, slide/bolt forward with a loaded feed tube or loaded magazine inserted.
Exception: Spent round in the chamber constitutes an empty chamber.

I wonder if this is directly due to people getting DQd for ditching their shotguns when it locks back on an empty chamber, but not realizing that it didn't feed the last round out of the tube.  I saw a number of people get DQd like that last year.  This new rule would effectively make that OK.

also looks like us red dot users are now going to be forced to remove all mag extensions beyond factory capacity. thats a deal breaker for me and my club. we will be leaving the 3gn umbrella and i will not be renewing my membership.

theyre going to revise that part. be patient.

We HAD planned on signing our range in 3GN this year, not anymore.

There's NO WAY I will run 2 different rule sets for different matches, NOT gonna adopt these new ones either.

I keep telling everyone that common equipment division rules with what is already established helps participation, doing something drastically different hurts it.  The core divisions Limited/Tac-Iron, Tac Scope, and Open have to stay the same.  They're far too established.  The other outlying divisions can be tweaked or others added for specific matches that warrant them.

It's almost as if they have a marketing firm coming up with this stuff without even asking the people that are going to implement it.

New link to rules

http://tarheel3gun.com/t3gn/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/3-Gun-Nation-REGIONAL-SERIES-RULES-2015-FINAL-FORMAT-v4.pdf

Video I found on Facebook explaining the new Factory Division. Pistol mags limited to 15 rounds, but you can have extensions on them. (which is a change from the original new rules) Rifle mags limited to 30 rounds, no extensions allowed. Shotgun tubes limited to 8 rounds, must be plugged to only allow 8 rounds.

Factory Division explained

Really didn't see a change in the Production (Tac Optics), and Unlimted (Open) Divisions There were changes to Heavy Div's and the added Pistol Caliber Rifle Div's.

Not to big on the pistol abandoning rules that changed an pistol not being on safe when abandoned no longer being a DQ, but is now a time penalty.

I do understand the name changes for the divisions though. Seems they are trying to make it more TV friendly to get more exceptance for the sport.

Kinda like buying all new wheels and tires for your car cause you got a flat tire ( fixn things that aint broke)

I the goal was to attract NEW shooters, why not make a true Factory class?(I have no idea what the goal was)

Almost seems to me they are trying to split the shooters, either shoot 3gn or shoot 3 Gun.

If the sport schisms it will be between people that are trying to be professional athletes, and people that simply like shooting as a sport.

3 Gunners have consistently resisted USPSA asserting control over 3 Gun.  I don't believe that ranges that aren't already running 3 Gun are suddenly going to start because of 3GN.  I mean I'm sure it happens, but convincing long established clubs to run things differently will take significant incentives.  Matches where I live are already full, range time is booked up, and more shooters just makes match directors work harder.

Looking forward to bringing new 3GN shooters into the Factory division and not scaring them with $100s in equipment upgrades just to get started.  

Bring your pistols with 15 rounds in them, your rifles with factory 30 round mags, and your shotgun's with 8 round capable tubes and enjoy yourself.  

Really interested to see the pistol caliber guys shooting nearly every target with carbines too.

We were a 3GN club the past two years.  We will not be for 2015.  We ran our rules for all the stages last year, used 3GN rules only for classifiers.  It wasn't too much of a hassle since the penalties were the only real differences, but I'm not changing our divisions to suit their new rules.


I also do not like the relaxed safety standards.  We've considered making the rule on abandoned firearms "all manual safeties must be engaged whether loaded or empty", but it's not worth being different from common rule sets.  Stage DQ would be applicable for guns with safety off in that case.

You guys realize that you can also have club rules right? Don't like the abandonment rule, change it for your club. 1 of the local 3gun matches requires all abandoned guns to be completely empty, no mag & empty chamber, if you are going to be advancing in front of them. It's not a normal 3gun rule, but that's what they do.

Would have been nice to have some type of division for pump shotguns beside "heavy".

any updates on the new rules affects and how/if yall are running your matches last couple months